5 July 2001
Source: Digital file from the Court Reporters Office, Southern District of New York; (212) 805-0300.

This is the transcript of Day 74 of the trial, July 5, 2001.

See other transcripts: http://cryptome.org/usa-v-ubl-dt.htm

                                                                    8743

       1   UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
           SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK
       2   ------------------------------x

       3   UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

       4              v.                           S(7) 98 Cr. 1023

       5   USAMA BIN LADEN, et al.,

       6                  Defendants.

       7   ------------------------------x

       8
                                                   New York, N.Y.
       9                                           July 5, 2001
                                                   9:30 a.m.
      10

      11

      12   Before:

      13                       HON. LEONARD B. SAND,

      14                                           District Judge

      15                            APPEARANCES

      16   MARY JO WHITE
                United States Attorney for the
      17        Southern District of New York
           BY:  PATRICK FITZGERALD
      18        MICHAEL GARCIA
                Assistant United States Attorneys
      19

      20

      21   DAVID RUHNKE
           DAVID STERN
      22        Attorneys for defendant Khalfan Khamis Mohamed

      23

      24

      25

                                                                    8744

       1            (In open court)

       2            THE COURT:  The jurors are all here.  I'm going to

       3   bring them in just to tell the jurors they can begin their

       4   deliberations and to excuse the alternates, with the same

       5   admonitions I gave them the last time.

       6            (Jury present)

       7            THE COURT:  Good morning.

       8            THE JURY:  Good morning.

       9            THE COURT:  Glad to see you all.  Hope you are all

      10   feeling well.  And the first order of business is the swearing

      11   of the marshal.

      12            Mr. Kenneally, will you swear the marshal.

      13            (Marshal sworn)

      14            THE COURT:  And ladies and gentlemen, you may return

      15   to the jury room and you may begin your deliberations.  And

      16   will the three alternates please remain in the courtroom.

      17            (The jury retires to deliberate upon a verdict at

      18   9:42 a.m.)

      19            THE COURT:  Ladies and gentlemen, my instructions to

      20   you this time are the same as the last, and that is that you

      21   are to continue to regard yourselves as being members of this

      22   jury.  You should not read, watch, listen to or anything about

      23   this case, and that you keep advised -- I assume the marshal

      24   has your telephone number, and we will let you know when the

      25   jury reaches a verdict so that you know that you are being

                                                                    8745

       1   discharged.  And until that time, why, you are on-call if the

       2   need should arise.  And you are excused for the day and thank

       3   you very much for coming.

       4            ALTERNATE JURORS:  Thank you.

       5            (Alternates excused)

       6            THE COURT:  Anything?

       7            MR. RUHNKE:  No, your Honor.

       8            MR. FITZGERALD:  No, Judge.

       9            THE COURT:  We'll await word from the jury.  If they

      10   follow a pattern, we should get a note fairly soon with a

      11   request for whatever it is they may want to see.

      12            One lawyer for each side to remain in the courtroom.

      13            (Recess pending verdict)

      14            (In open court; time noted:  10:35 a.m.)

      15            THE COURT:  I understand there are some problems with

      16   respect to the jury's note.

      17            MR. FITZGERALD:  Yes, Judge.  I think we have the

      18   exhibits correlated.  There are just three issues.

      19            There is one exhibit number which does not exist,

      20   Government Exhibit 4369.  So I think we need to ask the jury

      21   what they are referring to since there is no exhibit

      22   corresponding to that exhibit.

      23            THE COURT:  4369?

      24            MR. FITZGERALD:  Yes.

      25            THE COURT:  Okay.

                                                                    8746

       1            MR. FITZGERALD:  And then two of the exhibits the

       2   jury asked for are not in evidence, that would be 35175-C from

       3   the government exhibit list and K.K.M. 30 from the defense

       4   exhibit list.

       5            THE COURT:  Which one?

       6            MR. FITZGERALD:  K.K.M.-30.

       7            THE COURT:  K.K.M.-30.

       8            MR. FITZGERALD:  30.

       9            THE COURT:  4369 is --

      10            MR. FITZGERALD:  We don't know.  There is nothing

      11   corresponding to that number.

      12            THE COURT:  There is no exhibit with that number.

      13            MR. RUHNKE:  Your Honor, just one matter.

      14            THE COURT:  K.K.M. 30, and what was the other one?

      15            MR. RUHNKE:  With regard to the other one --

      16            THE COURT:  Just tell me the number before you --

      17            MR. RUHNKE:  Okay.  The other one was Government

      18   Exhibit 3517S-C.

      19            THE COURT:  Yes.

      20            MR. FITZGERALD:  35175-C.

      21            MR. RUHNKE:  I'm sorry.

      22            THE COURT:  What about that?

      23            MR. RUHNKE:  Your Honor, that was not offered.  It is

      24   the rough interview notes of Correction Officer Santulli by

      25   Agent Randazzo.  We did not offer it, mostly through an

                                                                    8747

       1   oversight.  We should have offered it.  I don't think the

       2   government would have objected to it had we offered it at the

       3   time.

       4            The other exhibit, K.K.M. 30, I understand the

       5   government would object to, so I'm not pushing it.  I wonder

       6   if it could be sent.

       7            MR. GARCIA:  Your Honor, with respect to 35175, it

       8   actually was offered.  The government objected.  The Court

       9   held it out and said you could call Agent Randazzo, the agent.

      10   The agent was called, he was examined on the issue, and the

      11   exhibit was never offered.

      12            But 35175-C was offered.

      13            THE COURT:  And therefore, the government's position

      14   is what?

      15            MR. GARCIA:  Is that it shouldn't come in.

      16            THE COURT:  Should or should not?

      17            MR. GARCIA:  Should not come in.

      18            THE COURT:  You know, I think you draw a line between

      19   what is in evidence and what is not in evidence, and if you

      20   start to deviate from that, then there are no boundaries.

      21            MR. RUHNKE:  Your Honor, there is one more thing we

      22   need to tell the jury in the note, and that is that although

      23   we have been sending in 12 copies of everything they have

      24   asked for, we are going to send in one set of what they have

      25   asked for and we will begin copying so they can have the 12

                                                                    8748

       1   sets; but we wanted to reply to their request as promptly as

       2   possible.

       3            THE COURT:  So the note reads, which is at the bottom

       4   of the Xerox of their note:  "Attached is one set of the

       5   exhibits you requested.  Twelve copies will be sent in when

       6   available."

       7            And I have got a footnote next to 4369 saying, "There

       8   is no exhibit with that number.  Please advise"; and two

       9   asterisks next to K.K.M. 30 and 35175-C which says "not in

      10   evidence."

      11            MR. FITZGERALD:  And the only other thing your Honor

      12   should be aware of, we agree with the defense that when they

      13   asked for 32A, the exhibits were a set of reports the jury did

      14   not see of A through D, the Al-'Owhali reports.  So we sent

      15   all of them in in response.

      16            I think with regard to K.K.M. 8, there was a second

      17   part of it, 8B, but it was part of the same exhibit.  So, in

      18   fairness, we sent in both pieces.

      19            MR. RUHNKE:  That's correct.

      20            THE COURT:  K.K.M. 8 is also included in 32A?

      21            MR. FITZGERALD:  No.  We sent in 8 and 8B.

      22            THE COURT:  Yes.

      23            MR. FITZGERALD:  And 32A, we sent in 32A through D,

      24   since they were part of one set.

      25            THE COURT:  8 is A and B and 32A is A through D.

                                                                    8749

       1            MR. FITZGERALD:  Thank you, Judge.

       2            THE COURT:  All right.  We'll send this in to the

       3   jury then.

       4            A juror advises that she has an appointment with a

       5   doctor on July 11 at 9 a.m., and we will wait until Monday and

       6   rearrange her appointment.

       7            (Recess pending verdict; time noted: 10:40 a.m.)

       8            (Adjourned to 9:30 a.m. on July 9, 2001)

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